Posts by Bloody Hotdogs!

22

Are JWs creationists?

by Jeffro in

if you believe what is officially stated on the jw website, jws are not creationists.

.

the fact that the exact jw belief is in fact specifically called "day-age creationism" seems to have alluded them.

Bloody Hotdogs!

JWs love to say they're nothing like those crazy Young Earthers. They list two important differences:

1. JWs believe creation took place over much longer time period.

2. JWs don’t push their views politically.

What Witnesses fail to point out, is there really aren’t any other differences.

Young Earthers claim that the earth gets it's appearance of great age from Noah's Flood, which caused: collapse of the 'heavenly ocean', changes in radiation levels, shortened life spans, messed-up radio carbon dating, re-shuffling of continents over a few months, flash ice ages and frozen wooly mammoths, disappearance of dinosaurs, change in human and animal diets, carving of great canyons, rising of mountain ranges, all sedimentary rock layers, sea shells on top of mountains, super fast "micro" evolution, and so on....

Young Earthers also believe in: Noah's arc, angels, demons, God, sin, heaven, Jesus, human sacrifice pleases God, inerrant bible, 6000 years of human existence, nearly all secular ancient world history is a lie, and so on....

This is precisely what Jehovah's Witnesses believe.

37

MAYBE THE DUMBEST THING I'VE EVER READ

by Bloody Hotdogs! in

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[endif]i was just sent the article "creation declares the glory of god!

i think it might contain the stupidest paragraph i have ever read:.

Bloody Hotdogs!

SBF: "There is absolutely no comfort in science. "

Science gives the comfort of ever increasing accurate knowledge.

I can rest easy knowing that no human sacrifice is required to redeem me.

When I die, I die. Death is not punishment.

I will probably die of old age, not tooth decay at 48 years old.

Religion offers demonstrably false comfort. False comfort is no comfort at all.

37

MAYBE THE DUMBEST THING I'VE EVER READ

by Bloody Hotdogs! in

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[endif]i was just sent the article "creation declares the glory of god!

i think it might contain the stupidest paragraph i have ever read:.

Bloody Hotdogs!

I was just sent the article "Creation Declares the Glory of God!" (w04 6/1 pp.9-14). I think it might contain the stupidest paragraph I have ever read:

" Scientific research is limited—restricted to what humans can actually observe or study. Otherwise it is mere theory or guesswork. Since “God is a Spirit,” he simply cannot be subjected to direct scientific scrutiny. It is arrogant, therefore, to dismiss faith in God as unscientific. Scientist Vincent Wigglesworth of Cambridge University observed that the scientific method itself is “a religious approach.” How so? “It rests upon an unquestioning faith that natural phenomena conform to ‘laws of nature.’” So when someone rejects belief in God, is he not simply exchanging one type of faith for another? In some cases, disbelief appears to be a deliberate refusal to face the truth. The psalmist wrote: “The wicked one according to his superciliousness makes no search; all his ideas are: ‘There is no God.’”"

"Scientific research is limited—restricted to what humans can actually observe or study."

Agreed.

"Otherwise it is mere theory or guesswork."

Agreed.

" Since “God is a Spirit,” he simply cannot be subjected to direct scientific scrutiny."

Therefore God is "mere theory or guesswork." God by this definition is indistiguoshable from something that does not exist.

"It is arrogant, therefore, to dismiss faith in God as unscientific."

My brain has turned to liquid.

"Scientist Vincent Wigglesworth of Cambridge University observed that the scientific method itself is “a religious approach.” How so? “It rests upon an unquestioning faith that natural phenomena conform to ‘laws of nature.’”"

(Classic example of quote mining) "Look at those ridiculous scientists with their religious faith! Religious! Faith! See? They're just as bad as us!"

" So when someone rejects belief in God, is he not simply exchanging one type of faith for another?"

How long ago was this creationist junk debunked? Has no one told them?

"In some cases, disbelief appears to be a deliberate refusal to face the truth."

Does this make your blood boil?

170

Proof of Noah's Flood - Presently watching a Documentary about Europe & the Ice Age

by *lost* in

first time i ever heard anyone say there was 'proof' of noah's flood.. very interesting,.

showed a trawler, where the team dredges regularly in the north sea - for animal bones, massive land animal bones, mammoths.. he said, originally, the bones were sent for analysis, and the dr stated, they were proof of noah's flood.. the north sea area was a land mass of dry grazing lands.

and it was very similar to africa.. many bones were found in london, of lions, hippos, etc ... when they were digging out the underground.. .

Bloody Hotdogs!

It seems the documentary was referring to Doggerland. Doggerland is the area now covered by the English Channel and the North Sea. It was once a fertile river basin inhabited by all manor of prehistoric life, including thousands of humans. At the end of the last ice age sea levels rose and submerged Doggerland under about 30m of water. This is in no way "proof" of Noah’s flood, because the submersion was complete by about 8000 years ago, and has never since subsided.

25

Did anyone notice this?? Think: Noah's Arc

by Bloody Hotdogs! in

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[endif]the september 2013 awake has this to say about the length of zheng he's treasure ships:.

"historical records from the ming dynasty say that zheng hes treasure ships were amazingly large447 feet (136 m) long and 183 feet (56 m) wide.

Bloody Hotdogs!

The September 2013 Awake has this to say about the length of Zheng He's treasure ships:

"Historical records from the Ming dynasty say that Zheng He’s treasure ships were amazingly large—447 feet (136 m) long and 183 feet (56 m) wide. Scholars find these figures problematic and hard to verify, in that wooden sailing ships in excess of 300 feet (90 m) in length are structurally unsound.

“All indications are that exaggeration has been at work in the accounts that mention the ships’ enormous size,” says one article on the subject. “A ship of about 200-250 ft [60-75 m] would make much more sense than the 450 ft [135 m] one.” Whatever the case, in the 15th century, vessels measuring over 200 feet (60 m) in length were certainly exceptional, and Zheng He’s fleet included up to 62 of them!"

I had been lead to believe that wooden ships 450' long were rather easy to build (a 600 year old man could do it!) and ridiculously seaworthy. But maybe Zheng's big mistake was building his ships with rounded, pressure-resistant ribbed hulls. Everyone knows that perfectly square and flat-bottomed is the way to go.

42

Is it GOOD that God KILLS BABIES??? Help needed in debate

by Bloody Hotdogs! in

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[endif]hello all,.

my wife and i are atheists, raised and living as jehovah's witnesses.

Bloody Hotdogs!

Thanks for all your good advice! Wish I could have used more of it, but here's how the conversation went:

My mom came prepared to talk about two specific cases: the death of David’s son and the death of all Egypt's first born.

To the first, she said God had nothing to do with killing David's son. The baby was probably already sick. The words 'and Jehovah dealt a blow to the child so that it took sick' could mean anything, including that God simply allowed it to die of a preexisting condition.

To the second, she said God would never have killed any Egyptian child that had the right heart condition.

To say the least, we had to agreed to disagree. Have you ever heard those arguments applied to these stories?? I hadn't, and am frankly gob smacked. It's an outright denial of the Bible's own account, is it not? There's no way those are the official WT talking points, is there?

42

Is it GOOD that God KILLS BABIES??? Help needed in debate

by Bloody Hotdogs! in

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[endif]hello all,.

my wife and i are atheists, raised and living as jehovah's witnesses.

Bloody Hotdogs!

Hello all,

My wife and I are atheists, raised and living as Jehovah's Witnesses. It's been a real struggle to keep up the facade, but we've managed - I'm even an MS!

Anyway, my mother came for dinner the other night and started to talk about the Zone Overseer's special talk. She loved the part about God's generosity: "Jehovah could have given us half a lung; that would have been sufficient. But no, he gave us two full ones! How generous!" I replied that my lack of wings must mean that God is cheep and greedy. She then asked if something was wrong - did I have some secret problem with JWs? I let the cat out of the bag: 'Yes, I do have a problem with JWs, and all religion for that matter. There seem to be certain facts about the universe and our world that don’t jive with doctrine, yada yada yada..... And what's more, I think the supposed actions Jehovah in the Bible are cruel and immoral - specifically the killing of babies....."

To my surprise, my mother took it all in stride, and offered to help us 'regain God's view on matters' such as child killing. So, later today she is literally coming over to convince us that killing children is good in certain circumstances.

I was wondering if any of you have gems of reason I could throw her way. Have any of you debated this topic with success? What might be the best approach to take?

Cheers!!

6

Funny / Sad Story

by Bloody Hotdogs! in

jw
friends

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Bloody Hotdogs!

The one thing I have to thank JWs for is the endless supply of stories.

I grew up in a small town about an hours drive from the nearest city. It was a huge rural territory that attracted a lot of miss-fits from elsewhere. One I remember was a morbidly obese, forever single, unemployed pioneer sister who was famous for coming late to meetings – like during the last paragraph of the Watchtower study. She would make her way to the second row from the front, heft her brontosaurian girth sideways through the audience, and sit down with her feet on the seat under her. Then her hair would come out. For the last five minuets of the meeting she would lose it and run her fingers straight up in the air through all its thick, home-dyed glory.

She was also famous for befriending seriously troubled people in the territory. One summer she came across Sally*, who like herself was obese and going through a hard time. Sally accepted a bible study, but soon announced it would have to stop. Sally was losing her apartment and had to leave town. Well, it wasn’t long before Sally had moved in with this sister – into a cramped bachelor suite in a rundown rental building known as the ‘animal house’. They shared a bed.

Sally had started coming to meetings. Now, us kids knew something was up. Sally was an especially ugly lady. Remember that episode of the Simpsons when Homer gets so fat he wears a dress? Well, this lady could’ve been his double. My best friend used to joke that she was probably a man, but that stopped when my mom overheard us and flipped out.

As the months passed Sally got back on her feet and was able to rent her own apartment. A congregation house-warming party was organized, the Community Hall was rented, and Sally was showered with gifts and ‘warm Christian love’.

Some time after this, odd things started to happen. Whenever Sally got up at the Kingdome Hall to use the bathroom, an elder would follow. Then, someone saw Sally using the men’s washroom. Then, Sally was gone.

Yes, Sally was a man. Yes, Sally had spent months sharing a bed with one of our most notable pioneer sisters. Yes, this was very funny to us kids.

*Some names have been changed

12

A Visit From a Jehovah's Witness Elder

by RayPublisher in

here's an interview with my buddy gregg i did last year when an elder visited him.

he was a bit shook up at the time but he handled himself really well imo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kg6ehebenm.

Bloody Hotdogs!

@ Ray and friends: How can you be so reasoned and logical, yet miss the bigger picture? Gods probably don't exist. The bible is a silly book.

It would be so refreshing to hear a debate with JWs that centers around science (facts vs. beliefs). How do JWs square Antarctic ice core data with Noah's flood and the water canopy? Why is there no sign that millions of Israelites spent 40 years in the wilderness? You know, there’s no sure-fire way to discern a virgin girl, right? Did Jehovah make meteoroids? How did Moa birds get to New Zealand? Hawaiian Island chain vs. Insight Book geology.

If anyone has a YouTube link to that sort of debate, I'd love to watch it!

5

RUSSIAN METEOR! Did God make meteoroids?

by Bloody Hotdogs! in

did jehovah set meteoroids in motion billions of years ago when he created the solar system, or has satan been manufacturing them since his fall?

after all, it seems rather imperfect of god to have created such flyee, crashy, smashy, destroyee things.

Bloody Hotdogs!

Kurt: my question is a joke, but I suspect the JW's answers will not be.